Matty's Lounge: November 2009

This is a thought experiment of what love is. Keep an open mind when reading it as it touches on subjects that are against society norms. It is meant to be a way of getting ideas down on paper and to spark open discussion on the subject.

Please feel open to comment on this thought experiment as I am very curious to see every one's opinion and it was made for open discussion. Thank you and please keep this a discussion and respect the opinions of people that differ from yours.

Enjoy!

What Is Love?

A Thought Exercise

I have trouble with understanding emotions. I will lump every emotion I feel into two categories, either happy or angry, as to not have to deal with them. It was recently pointed out to me that the reason I do this is because I don’t have a working definition of the emotion or group of emotions I am feeling and so instead of understanding it I will bottle it up into happy or angry so I can deal with the situation at hand with logic. As any good son would do, I talked about that realization with my Mom. She agreed with the person that pointed this out and suggested that to help me understand I should write about it. So, here I am studying specific emotions, looking up the definitions, writing about what I think they mean, and putting forth thought exercises. A thought exercise is just a way of getting ideas down and looking at alternate possibilities outside the society norm as to spark thinking and discussion. I would love to hear your response and opinion on the subject.

What is Love? According to Webster’s Dictionary love has many meanings.

1. A strong affection for another arising out of kinship or personal ties

2. An attraction based on sexual desire: affection and tenderness felt by lovers

3. An affection based on admiration, benevolence, or common interests

Okay so basically Webster’s is describing three types of love; family love, romantic love, and friendship love. I know that ‘affection’ for someone else is love and I can see that ‘attraction based on sexual desire’ is needed for romantic love. Hell, everyone, including myself, can understand attraction based on sexual desire. But, what is the definition of affection? According to Webster’s Dictionary affection also has many meanings.

1. A moderate feeling or emotion

2. A tender attachment: Fondness

3. The feeling aspect (as in pleasure) of consciousness

It looks like Webster’s is saying that affection is caring. So therefore caring for the well being of another person would be love. That makes sense; I can follow that line of thinking. I am concerned about the definition of love that is an attraction based on sexual desire, how is that caring for the well being of another person? It sounds to me how I would define lust. What is the meaning of lust? According to Webster’s Dictionary lust, again, also has many meanings.

1. An intense or unbridled sexual desire: lasciviousness

2. An intense longing: craving

It sounds like the differences between lust and romantic love is just the intensity of the sexual desire and that the difference between romantic love and other forms of love is that you have sexual desire. This begs the question, is caring and lust all that is needed for romantic love?

Thought Experiment #1

Is it possible to lust for a friend and it not be romantic love? Or if you lust for a friend does it become romantic love?

You have a friendship with somebody it means that you love that person because you care about their well being. You have similar interests, you both enjoy each other’s company, provide comfort for each other during rough times, and you both help each other out when one of you has a problem. By definition you have a friendship love for that person. It just so happens that this friend of yours is physically attractive and that you also lust for this person. Right now you have strong sexual desires for someone you love as a friend. If you have sex with your friend do you now have romantic love for this person? Or are you just lusting after a person you have a friendship with? The line here is very fuzzy and I believe that different people would feel different things. But, what are they really feeling? It is easy to see how lust in this situation can easily be confused with romantic love.

Thought Experiment #2

Is it possible to lust for someone and then later on develop a caring for their well being and it not become romantic love? Or if you lust for someone and later develop a caring for their well being does it become romantic love?

You see a person at the coffee shop. You don’t know this person; you don’t even know their name. But, they are attractive and you have strong sexual desires for that person. You get the nerve to talk to that person and you find out you have similar interests, things go well and you end up having sex with them. Afterwards you continue to talk to that person and over time you develop a caring for their well being. Do you now have romantic love for that person? Or do you just care about the well being of someone you lust after? Just like the previous example the line is very fuzzy and it is easy to see how caring for someone’s well being you lust after can be confused with romantic love.

Sex is the common denominator here and is bonding lust and romantic love into a blurry line. Is sex the only thing that makes romantic love possible? I would think that romantic love has more to it than just sex. Sex is a natural act and although there are emotions that come into play when you have sex, the sex act itself is not an emotion and cannot be a definition of an emotion. So how do you know if what you feel with your sex partner is romantic love or just lust for someone you care about their well being? Sexual desire is different in the definitions of romantic love and lust only because of degree of intensity of that sexual desire. Since the sex act cannot be a feeling, what would be the feeling that separates romantic love from friendship love? I think that the difference between romantic love and friendship love would have to be the intensity of an emotion or group of emotions. When I look at people that I think are in romantic love it looks to me like the feeling of closeness is the group of emotions that have a higher intensity then with their friendships.

How does a person know if they are romantically in love with someone or if they just have lust for someone they love as a friend? Just as love and lust are very close it is possible that the feeling of closeness and sex are very close. The sex act will release hormones that make a person feel close to another person for a short period of time and because of that it will make that person feel as though they are feeling closeness when they are really just feeling the after effects of hormones released from the sex act. After considering this for a while it dawned on me that this confusion could be the reason for our high divorce rate. Sex has blurred the line for those people and one of two things happened. Either sex went away and now they are left with the core emotions that keep the relationship which did not have the high degree of intensity in closeness that they thought they had when the sex act was a regular occurrence and the relationship fell apart, or the sex is good and on a regular occurrence but their personalities clashed enough that they could not get a high enough degree of intensity in their closeness with sex alone and the relationship fell apart.

Thought experiment #3

How do you know if the you have a high enough degree of intensity in closeness to sustain romantic love if sex is making you think you are close to someone when you really are not? What if you take sex out of the equation? Sex has become a very taboo subject for most people and society has made sex feel almost like a dirty secret that everyone does but no one is allowed to discuss. Because of that secrecy, sex became something people feel they have to hide and when they have sex it has made the temporary feeling of closeness even stronger and the line between closeness and sex even more blurry. Although sex is an important part of a romantic relationship, it should not be the core that the relationship is based on. If sex is not made the core of the relationship then the core relationship can grow and the degree of intensity in closeness can be easily determined. How do you take sex out of the equation? There are two ways that come to mind to do that. One way to do that is to not have sex until you can determine that you have a high degree of intensity in closeness with that person and you feel romantic love. But that plan has a flaw; it does not take into consideration the intensity of lust. If you refuse sex and try to let the relationship grow doesn’t lust also grow in intensity? Lust in this situation can potentially make your mind feel that you are in romantic love because your mind is becoming desperate to have sex with that person. The other way to take sex out of the equation is to not make sex important. Consider a couple in an open relationship. They will have multiple sex partners but they are in romantic love with only the person they are in the open relationship with. If sex is downgraded to a fun activity then the core relationship is easier to see and the degree of intensity in closeness is more apparent.

For many people the idea of an open relationship will make them cringe. What is the reason behind that? Some would say it is a degree of security in the person, others may say that it is a matter of trust. Society makes sex a bad thing that should be kept secret but at the same time will use sex as a selling point in the media. This contradiction will make anyone insecure and think that only beautiful people are allowed to be secure enough in their sexuality to express it. Since the mass majority of the population, myself included, does not meet this ideal of beautiful we are given by the media our security in ourselves is destroyed and we now have generations of kids growing up thinking that they are not good enough to be loved or express their sexuality because of fear of rejection and ridicule. Trust becomes a factor for some people because of this insecurity that we all have now. What does it mean to truly trust someone? You trust that they will fight for your best interest; you trust that they will be there for you when you need it; you trust that they will not do anything to hurt you, and you trust that they will keep you safe. Why does the fact that your romantic partner only has sex with you give you that feeling of trust? It is again because of sexual insecurity. Just about everyone is insecure with their sexuality, so when they finally allow someone inside their insecurity and have sex with them they get a feeling of trusting that person. But as hormones will give you a temporary feeling of closeness with your sex partner it is also true that sex will give you a temporary feeling of security which will translate into trust. But, that person you had sex with didn’t do anything yet to earn your trust besides not reject you sexually. Your long term friendships have the same trust as your romantic relationship even though you are not having sex with them. So, how can your friendships have the same trust as your romantic relationship? Because trust is built over time and with experiences you have with that person, not with sex.

Thank you for keeping an open mind during this thought experiment. Please give your feedback and opinions.

***************UPDATE 11/22/09*************

In reading responses I have gotten on this blog it has been pointed out to me that many people that choose a monogamous relationship say that "commitment" is the factor that allows love to grow and flourish. I agree with those people that if you love someone and want a monogamous relationship with them that commitment is very important. I also want to point out that I would also probably not be able to do an open relationship, but the idea intrigued me. If a person is going to be in a committed relationship and they know that they love that person then they have nothing to worry about. This blog was only meant as a thought experiment, to spark discussion and give people an alternate idea then the norm. Thanks to all that has responded, all comments from all point of views are very welcome. ;p

*******************UPDATE 06/27/2010***************

After a lot of self exploration of my feelings and thoughts I have come to the conclusion that I could be in an open relationship if the option presented itself. The reason I was able to come to this conclusion is because I don't feel that love is dependent on sexual monogamy, but instead is dependent on trust and sex does not build trust. If sex built trust then you would never be able to trust family or friends. The way to build trust is by being there when the person needs you for support and protecting their personal space. In any relationship there are boundaries created for that relationship that all parties understand. The difference between monogamous relationships and open relationships is that the boundaries for monogamous relationships don't need to be said because it is our current social norm and is already understood by everyone. An open relationship's boundaries are instead created between the people involved based on their needs. Here are some examples of boundaries that could be in an open relationship:

1. If you are living together then the bedroom is your personal space and only shared between you and your partner with exceptions only agreed upon by both of you.

2. A certain activity that only you and your partner share, like a specific restaurant you eat at or a special spot in the park that you share time in.

3. A specific day that is set apart for only you and your partner.

Open relationships are not for everyone and communication is very important for it to work. But, I think that it would benefit certain personality types and decrease the amount of divorce and animosity that can happen when those personality types are forced into a relationship they are uncomfortable with. Explore your own feelings to discover the best type of relationship for you. Keep an open mind and good luck. Comments are appreciated.

***************UPDATE 6/30/2010****************

Okay, there seems to be some major confusion with my thought experiment. I am not suggesting that everyone needs to be in an open relationship, free love, and bring the 60's back. When I started this I was just trying to figure out the emotion of love, but as I was writing it I realized that I had been creating insecurities about sex and women that were damaging to my self-confidence. So, I turned it into a thought experiment. A thought experiment is just an exercise in your mind to help you figure out things about yourself that social norm's will inhibit. We are constantly trying to force ourselves to fit into what society tells us we have to. When we do that and the social norm is against our true self we end up creating façade personalities because we are afraid that we will not be accepted otherwise. I used this thought experiment to help me strip away most of my insecurities, eliminate the fear of rejection, and understand how women think. This is how my thought experiment did that for me.

Everyone has insecurities, some people have a strong fear of rejection, and most people (including some women) don't understand how women think. We will start with insecurities. When we meet a new person we all put on our best personality suit, the best of our personality minus the stuff we consider crap. When we do this we create insecurities about the stuff we consider crap. In my personal case my insecurities included: My body, penis size (most men have this insecurity), not being sensitive enough, trusting another person, not being attractive to women, and jealousy. I have been stuck with those insecurities and they in turn would lower my self-esteem so I would hide them when I met a woman I was interested in. Instead I would try to put forward the parts of my personality I considered assets like being a nice guy, a good listener, protector, and basically a teddy bear. What that got me was a lot of women that I was instantly stuck in the "friend zone" with. After many years of putting forward that personality I was getting stressed and frustrated. But, I had a hard time understanding why I was so frustrated and would blame it on anything else I could think of that made logical sense to me. Well, I was wrong and it turned out to be because I was hiding parts of myself and who I really was for so long that I had forgotten what my true personality was and the pressure got to be too great.

To get out of this frame of mind I decided to do something that would help me figure out what my insecurities where and the meaning behind them. The only way I know how to fix a problem is to first consider the extremes. I threw out the idea of what the social norm was for a relationship and tried to think about the most extreme relationship type I could. That took me to a very dark place in my mind and it was a disturbing exercise, but it allowed me to think outside the box. After putting myself through that I started researching different relationship types that people will actually do today. I found information on Polyamory, Open, Homosexual, Polygamy, and Monogamy. I am not attracted to men so I threw out Homosexuality. I’m an Agnostic and don't believe in religious Polygamy so I threw that out. Also, I have been in a Monogamous relationship before and so I threw that out. That left me with Polyamory and Open relationships. For the most part the two relationship types are close enough that it didn't matter which one I choose for my thought experiment and self exploration so I went with the Open relationship.

I pictured myself in an open relationship, how I would react to my partner having sex with other people, and why I would react in an angry fashion. I found that I was jealous, feared rejection, insecure that the other guy was better looking, had a bigger penis, was more fit, and a better lover. As I analyzed this and compared it to past monogamous relationships I have had I found that my insecurities were unfounded. If she wasn't attracted to me then she wouldn't be in this open relationship in the first place. If she was going to reject me for another guy she would have done so a while ago, but I must provide something she wants because she keeps coming back to me. I also found from this analysis and thinking back on conversations I’ve had with women I have been with that my penis size is actually very good and I have nothing to worry about. If she wasn't okay with my body then she wouldn't have gone this far to begin with. I spent the next couple of weeks thinking about how I would handle being in an open relationship and I started to become comfortable with the idea. My insecurities were being stripped away and I was able to see myself being able to have an open relationship without jealousy, fear of rejection, or physical insecurities. This does not mean that I now prefer to be in an open relationship, it only means that I can comfortably be in an open relationship if I found myself in one. It also means that if we both decide to be in a monogamous relationship then I will also be just as comfortable. THE TYPE OF RELATIONSHIP DOES NOT MATTER! WHAT MATTERS IS THAT I USED THE SCENARIO IN MY HEAD TO FIND MY TRUE PERSONALITY! That is the part I think a lot of people are confused on. But, I digress…

Now that my insecurities were melting away I started thinking about why the fear of rejection also went away. I found out that the fear of rejection when you first meet someone is very minimal and that you are just afraid that they will reject the personality that you offer them. But, you have no invested interest with this person yet. On the other hand, if they accept that best suit personality then you now have to keep that personality going. Over time it becomes more stressful to keep up that personality and the fear of rejection grows as your feelings for that person grows. This is because you now have an invested interest in this person and if you allow yourself to show your true personality then there is a risk that your partner will reject the true personality and now the fear of rejection has become a greater risk. As years go by you get to a point where you are stressed out and tired of keeping up this best suit personality and you have forgotten what your true personality is. Breaking up with your partner is usually inevitable and because you don't know what is causing the stress you start to blame it on anything you can find: your partner isn't supporting you enough, you have to much outside stress in your life, you’re not in love anymore but you don't know why, and the list goes on and on.

So, if you spend the time to think about putting yourself into a situation outside the social norm you have been trying to force yourself into and that you feel would be uncomfortable for you then over time you will be able to strip away your insecurities to find your true personality. You now can eliminate the fear of rejection by throwing away your best suit personality and only using your true personality. To eliminate the fear of rejection when you first meet a person you have to consider the following: For every 100 people you meet you will find maybe 20 people that will be attracted to and accept your true personality. You will have to learn and get use to the fact that if someone rejects you when you first meet them that they are not attracted to your personality and that is fine, because there are others that will be. You cannot ‘win’ over a partner by faking a personality that is not a true self; you can however find people that are attracted to who you really are.

Now that you have discovered your true personality and eliminated the fear of rejection you will have to start over in creating relationships. To do this you will need to understand how men and women think. In my research and personal observations I found that people will make decisions and take actions based on either logic or emotion. Although there are many different types of people there are also some universal similarities that I can say are true for most of the men and women out there. I cannot say all men and women are this way, but great majorities are and the insight will help anyway in your own self explorations.

Logical Men will be asked a question like, “What do you look for in a woman?” and they will think about it logically to come up with a female type they think will suit them. Then when that man is presented with a scenario where he meets a woman like that he will act with the same logic and pursue her. Emotional men will do the same thing but use emotion for both the thinking and the acting. Women, however, do not do this. Instead if you ask a woman a question like, “What do you look for in a man?” then they will think about it logically to come up with a male type they think they would like. Most women will logically decide they want something close to (but not including all) a nice guy that will treat her well, makes her laugh, is sensitive, a good listener, and will open up his feelings to her. This is fine, he sounds like a great guy, but the problem comes when that same woman is presented with the scenario of meeting this person. Now here is the kicker, instead of using the same logic to act she will now use emotion. Because she is using emotion to act, when she is presented with the guy she logically decided would be her type she sees him as a wussy momma’s boy and has zero attraction for him, but he makes a great friend. Hence the “friend zone” is created. This same woman meets a guy that is cocky and full of self-confidence, her emotional response is that this guy is a man’s man, strong, and will protect her. This sparks attraction, the problem is that 80% of cocky guys are also assholes. Now, she is in a relationship with an asshole and complains about it to her guy friend that has everything that she logically said she wanted. But, she can’t date the guy friend because he doesn’t spark the attraction and women cannot date a man they have zero attraction for.

This is why men are so confused about women and why we complain that they make no sense what-so-ever. From a man’s point of view when a woman says they like a specific type of guy then we try to emulate it to earn the woman’s attraction. But, what men (and some women) don’t know is that you will never be able to ‘earn’ or ‘win’ her attraction, it’s either there or it isn’t because it is an emotional response and out of her control.

For the men out there, we need to work on shedding our insecurities and fear of rejection. When we do this our self-confidence will naturally go up. If you try to emulate what women say they are attracted to then for every 100 women you meet, almost zero will be attracted to you. But, if you are your true self and have the self-confidence of knowing who you are then for every 100 women you meet, you will find around 20 that are attracted to your personality. As men we need to stop trying to think about what women want and just be ourselves. Although women like a good looking guy, his physical appearance is not what sparks attraction. It may spark lust, but that is totally different. Physical appearance is the first thing they see but women don’t decide if they are attracted to a man as quick as we do. It only takes men a millisecond to decide they are attracted to a woman. It takes women much longer and they need to notice other things about you first. Some of those things (but not including all) are to hear how well you talk, see how intelligent you are, see how you dress, see how confident you are, see how you carry yourself, notice your level of hygiene, see if you can make her laugh or smile, etc… before her emotional self will decide to be attracted or not.

For the women out there, some of you are aware of this dichotomy you have battling in your minds and some are not. Either way you should try to take notice of what it is that sparks attraction for you. Once you are aware of what your personal emotional attractions are then you should compare them to the logical list of what you told yourself you look for in a guy. You should not fight the emotional attraction and instead adjust for the logic as well by adding the logical list on top of the emotional response. So, when you meet a guy that sparks your attraction spend a little extra time to see if he also has some of the same qualities that are on your logical list. If he has mostly things that are the opposite of your logical list then he may end up becoming one of the assholes you complain about to your guy friends and you should consider not moving forward with the relationship.

For both men and women, spend the time to find out who you are and embrace your true personality. Once you do then you will have a base that will allow you to better yourself in the ways you want to, physical and emotional. This personal true self growth will allow you to fall in love with yourself again and if you love yourself then it will become very easy to find someone else that will agree and the attraction will happen naturally.

Comments are appreciated; I love a good discussion from all points of view.

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